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<head><meta charset="utf-8"><title>Meeting 2020-06-25 · wg-governance · Zulip Chat Archive</title></head>
<h2>Stream: <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/index.html">wg-governance</a></h2>
<h3>Topic: <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html">Meeting 2020-06-25</a></h3>

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<a name="201994825"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201994825" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> BatmanAoD (Kyle Strand) <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201994825">(Jun 25 2020 at 16:51)</a>:</h4>
<p>I forgot to mention this yesterday, but I will need to leave early from the meeting today.</p>



<a name="201996033"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201996033" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201996033">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:01)</a>:</h4>
<p>Hey <span class="user-group-mention" data-user-group-id="2317">@WG-governance</span> =)</p>



<a name="201996085"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201996085" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Manish Goregaokar <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201996085">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:02)</a>:</h4>
<p>hey</p>



<a name="201996122"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201996122" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201996122">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:02)</a>:</h4>
<p><span aria-label="wave" class="emoji emoji-1f44b" role="img" title="wave">:wave:</span></p>



<a name="201996202"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201996202" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> XAMPPRocky <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201996202">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:03)</a>:</h4>
<p>We’re having a meeting? I seem to have lost the event in my calendar.</p>



<a name="201996228"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201996228" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201996228">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:03)</a>:</h4>
<p>Hmm.</p>



<a name="201996232"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201996232" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201996232">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:03)</a>:</h4>
<p>It's in mine :)</p>



<a name="201996298"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201996298" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201996298">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:03)</a>:</h4>
<p>(and you're invited to it)</p>



<a name="201996346"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201996346" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Nell Shamrell-Harrington <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201996346">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:04)</a>:</h4>
<p>I've got in on mine too</p>



<a name="201996348"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201996348" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Nell Shamrell-Harrington <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201996348">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:04)</a>:</h4>
<p>must be gremlins in the calendar</p>



<a name="201996397"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201996397" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> XAMPPRocky <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201996397">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:04)</a>:</h4>
<p>Okay, well welcome to meeting everyone! I believe we wanted to continue to the discussion on working groups and <span class="user-mention" data-user-id="116009">@nikomatsakis</span> you posted a proposal earlier this week I believe.</p>



<a name="201996487"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201996487" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201996487">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:05)</a>:</h4>
<p>it's true, I did</p>



<a name="201996519"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201996519" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201996519">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:05)</a>:</h4>
<p><a href="#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/on.20working.20groups.20and.20teams/near/201788713">here</a></p>



<a name="201996548"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201996548" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201996548">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:06)</a>:</h4>
<p><span class="user-mention silent" data-user-id="116009">nikomatsakis</span> <a href="#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/on.20working.20groups.20and.20teams/near/201788713">said</a>:</p>
<blockquote>
<p>I've been thinking about it. It seems to me that there is perpetual confusion about the idea of working groups vs project groups etc. I'm not sure how truly harmful this is but I was thinking about an alternative. Given that we have a notion of "subteams" already (e.g., the dev-tools team has various subteams, etc), maybe we should simplify to:</p>
<ul>
<li>project groups -- execute a defined, often cross-cutting, project with relatively well-defined scope (e.g., project-ffi-unwind)</li>
<li>teams and subteams -- indefinite entities that exist to tend to a given area, codebase, etc</li>
</ul>
</blockquote>



<a name="201996626"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201996626" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201996626">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:06)</a>:</h4>
<p>Part of this would be trying to make the embedded wg an official team.</p>



<a name="201996687"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201996687" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> XAMPPRocky <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201996687">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:06)</a>:</h4>
<p>I’m all in favour of this</p>



<a name="201996741"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201996741" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201996741">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:07)</a>:</h4>
<p>I'm basically wondering if we can draw a fairly clear line -- I worry that having too many categories is too complex. It seems clear that teams aren't always permanent (e.g., docs team...), and we have a hierarchical team structure, so it seems like we can have teams for domains that we think are worth it.</p>



<a name="201996788"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201996788" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201996788">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:07)</a>:</h4>
<p>But by the same token I think it puts a suitable "barrier" to creating a team, and the idea of listing community groups or something might be a good "entry level".</p>



<a name="201996838"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201996838" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Nell Shamrell-Harrington <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201996838">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:08)</a>:</h4>
<p>sounds good to me</p>



<a name="201996876"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201996876" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201996876">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:08)</a>:</h4>
<p>I think one question mark is what happens to the other existing domain working groups</p>



<a name="201996896"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201996896" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201996896">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:08)</a>:</h4>
<p>bingo</p>



<a name="201996902"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201996902" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201996902">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:08)</a>:</h4>
<p>In particular, the ones that aren't strongly associated with a team</p>



<a name="201996908"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201996908" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201996908">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:08)</a>:</h4>
<p>I'm thinking of CLI and secure-code</p>



<a name="201996911"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201996911" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201996911">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:08)</a>:</h4>
<p>I'm not sure if there exist more?</p>



<a name="201996948"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201996948" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> XAMPPRocky <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201996948">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:09)</a>:</h4>
<p>Yeah I was about to ask which are even still active.</p>



<a name="201996964"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201996964" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201996964">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:09)</a>:</h4>
<p>There was one "networking", or "wg-async-foundations", but I think it can become essentially a project group.</p>



<a name="201996985"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201996985" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201996985">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:09)</a>:</h4>
<p>I think we could define a kind of goal for that</p>



<a name="201997006"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201997006" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201997006">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:09)</a>:</h4>
<p>So, those are two cases in the fuzzy place between project and not?</p>



<a name="201997082"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201997082" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201997082">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:10)</a>:</h4>
<p>I don't feel either CLI or secure-code is really "project" oriented</p>



<a name="201997110"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201997110" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201997110">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:10)</a>:</h4>
<p>are they active? could a parent be found to adopt them?</p>



<a name="201997173"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201997173" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201997173">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:11)</a>:</h4>
<p>well there is certainly activity in <a class="stream" data-stream-id="146229" href="/#narrow/stream/146229-wg-secure-code">#wg-secure-code</a></p>



<a name="201997210"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201997210" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Manish Goregaokar <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201997210">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:11)</a>:</h4>
<p>I would say secure code is largely a libs issue</p>



<a name="201997224"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201997224" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201997224">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:11)</a>:</h4>
<p>I tend to agree with that</p>



<a name="201997233"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201997233" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Manish Goregaokar <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201997233">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:11)</a>:</h4>
<p>based on how they operate</p>



<a name="201997256"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201997256" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201997256">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:11)</a>:</h4>
<p>Yeah, and I think it'd be plausible to make them a kind of secure code subteam</p>



<a name="201997324"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201997324" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201997324">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:12)</a>:</h4>
<p>one thing I will say is that, in the past, we had this idea that domain wgs were that way because they didn't have decision making power</p>



<a name="201997331"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201997331" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201997331">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:12)</a>:</h4>
<p>but then, the embedded wg has an rfc process</p>



<a name="201997346"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201997346" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201997346">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:12)</a>:</h4>
<p>it seems to me more that the question is not about "making decisions" but more like "the scope of those decisions"</p>



<a name="201997386"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201997386" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> XAMPPRocky <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201997386">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:12)</a>:</h4>
<p>If we're all in agreement on the proposal (which I believe we are), I think we should reach out to the wg leads and ask them if they would want to stay in project. I've had off-hand conversations where some of the leads have said they are unsure how much they benefit from being part of the project.</p>



<a name="201997414"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201997414" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201997414">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:13)</a>:</h4>
<p>I am wondering if the proposal is complete without this community group concept</p>



<a name="201997423"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201997423" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201997423">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:13)</a>:</h4>
<p>also I think I should try to write it up :)</p>



<a name="201997439"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201997439" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201997439">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:13)</a>:</h4>
<p>but I agree with the idea of scheduling some time to talk closely with the existing groups</p>



<a name="201997459"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201997459" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201997459">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:13)</a>:</h4>
<p>I would frame it more as "here is a working proposal and we'd like to see how you feel and would fit into that"</p>



<a name="201997523"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201997523" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201997523">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:14)</a>:</h4>
<p>Ok, so the proposed types of groups in the Rust project would be: teams, project groups parented by those teams. Outside of Rust would be community groups. Is this correct?</p>



<a name="201997531"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201997531" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201997531">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:14)</a>:</h4>
<p>Domain groups would go away?</p>



<a name="201997551"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201997551" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201997551">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:14)</a>:</h4>
<p>yeah, I think that those are just teams focused on a domain</p>



<a name="201997569"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201997569" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201997569">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:14)</a>:</h4>
<p>or else maybe not part of rust org officially</p>



<a name="201997576"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201997576" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201997576">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:14)</a>:</h4>
<p>i.e., a community group that we list</p>



<a name="201997660"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201997660" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201997660">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:15)</a>:</h4>
<p>So, there are teams and community groups, and some of those relate to domains. But there is no such thing as a domain group, in that picture. There are teams that work on domain-related stuff, and community groups that work on domain-related stuff. yes?</p>



<a name="201997708"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201997708" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201997708">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:15)</a>:</h4>
<p>correct</p>



<a name="201997773"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201997773" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> BatmanAoD (Kyle Strand) <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201997773">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:16)</a>:</h4>
<p>And there would be a formal difference between "team" and "subteam"?</p>



<a name="201997820"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201997820" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201997820">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:16)</a>:</h4>
<p>(that would be confusing : D )</p>



<a name="201997825"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201997825" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201997825">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:16)</a>:</h4>
<p>We already have a notion of "subteams", it's really just teams that "refine" part of the scope of their parent</p>



<a name="201997853"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201997853" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201997853">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:16)</a>:</h4>
<p>e.g. there is the dev-tools team and within there is clippy team</p>



<a name="201997874"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201997874" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201997874">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:17)</a>:</h4>
<p>similarly within community team there is events team</p>



<a name="201997899"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201997899" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201997899">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:17)</a>:</h4>
<p>I imagine that within compiler team there would be prioritization team</p>



<a name="201997914"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201997914" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201997914">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:17)</a>:</h4>
<p>(what we now call <a class="stream" data-stream-id="227806" href="/#narrow/stream/227806-t-compiler.2Fwg-prioritization">#t-compiler/wg-prioritization</a>)</p>



<a name="201997954"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201997954" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201997954">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:17)</a>:</h4>
<p>so they are teams, they are just parented teams</p>



<a name="201997956"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201997956" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201997956">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:17)</a>:</h4>
<p>?</p>



<a name="201997965"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201997965" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201997965">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:17)</a>:</h4>
<p>perhaps also subteams for specific areas, like the "type checker team" or whatever, per <a href="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues/288">https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues/288</a></p>



<a name="201997967"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201997967" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> XAMPPRocky <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201997967">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:18)</a>:</h4>
<p>Well I think the only difference between "team" and "subteam" is their relationship in the structure. What would be the difference between a "sub-team" and a "project group" be?</p>



<a name="201998025"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201998025" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201998025">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:18)</a>:</h4>
<p>Subteams don't have a defined goal</p>



<a name="201998049"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201998049" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201998049">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:18)</a>:</h4>
<p>they cover an area but aren't trying to complete a "project"</p>



<a name="201998105"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201998105" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201998105">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:19)</a>:</h4>
<p>But they don't need a separate definition, right?</p>



<a name="201998122"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201998122" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201998122">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:19)</a>:</h4>
<p>project groups have a charter to complete a specific project; I think they would typically also not have final decision making power, i.e., they are preparing a design (or menu of designs) for lang team</p>



<a name="201998174"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201998174" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201998174">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:19)</a>:</h4>
<p>yes, this is clear in the recent document XAMPPRocky wrote</p>



<a name="201998188"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201998188" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201998188">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:19)</a>:</h4>
<p>I think having the distinction of "a project group is a group focused on a particular project" is reasonable and useful, beacuse e.g. it'd be good to list all project groups on a separate page</p>



<a name="201998191"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201998191" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201998191">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:19)</a>:</h4>
<p>as a way to get involved in the project</p>



<a name="201998301"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201998301" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201998301">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:20)</a>:</h4>
<p>but also like a unit of planning</p>



<a name="201998349"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201998349" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> XAMPPRocky <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201998349">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:20)</a>:</h4>
<p>That makes sense to me. So what are the steps here to make this change?</p>



<a name="201998367"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201998367" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201998367">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:21)</a>:</h4>
<p>(my expectation for the <em>lang team</em> is that we we try  to encapsulate as much as possible our activities within active projects)</p>



<a name="201998427"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201998427" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201998427">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:21)</a>:</h4>
<p>I think writing the proposal in somewhat more detail and then approaching the existing working grousp and trying to fit them in</p>



<a name="201998520"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201998520" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201998520">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:22)</a>:</h4>
<p>I specifically put "working groups" and not just domain because we have various wgs that I think would be "reclassified" as subteams in this proposal (e.g., triage wg of the release team)</p>



<a name="201998530"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201998530" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201998530">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:22)</a>:</h4>
<p>but I think that's ok</p>



<a name="201998618"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201998618" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201998618">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:23)</a>:</h4>
<p>(similar, I think that e.g. the "windows group" or "ARM group" for the compiler team ought to be subteams <em>eventually</em>, right now they are just notification groups where we ping people -- is that distinction worth bringing into this?)</p>



<a name="201998678"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201998678" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201998678">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:23)</a>:</h4>
<p>...it's kind of an orthogonal thing but if we're trying to define the overall taxonomy of Rust governance structure...</p>



<a name="201998817"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201998817" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201998817">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:24)</a>:</h4>
<p>basically we have some groups in the compiler team (cleanup crew, windows group, etc) that people can just sign up for on their own, and then they get pinged</p>



<a name="201998837"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201998837" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> XAMPPRocky <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201998837">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:24)</a>:</h4>
<p>I think we could mention it but we don't have to be strict about the structure of those groups.</p>



<a name="201998864"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201998864" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201998864">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:24)</a>:</h4>
<p>it's not really a "group" in the same sense</p>



<a name="201998886"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201998886" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201998886">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:25)</a>:</h4>
<p>But those are still teams, yes? parented teams</p>



<a name="201999041"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201999041" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> XAMPPRocky <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201999041">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:26)</a>:</h4>
<p>Like something like "There are also groups of volunteers from the community who offer their time and advice to the Rust team".</p>



<a name="201999120"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201999120" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201999120">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:26)</a>:</h4>
<p>one thing I've considered is that teams/groups could have 4 categories of people associated with them:</p>
<ul>
<li>leads</li>
<li>members</li>
<li>notification.. people</li>
<li>alumni (former members)</li>
</ul>
<p>with leads and members being nominated for effort, and notification is a way that people can sign up to get pinged and aren't really "members" in the same sense.</p>



<a name="201999170"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201999170" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201999170">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:27)</a>:</h4>
<p>but now that I write it out I wonder if it's just too much complexity and it's better to just have "we also have lists you can sign up for", I don't know.</p>



<a name="201999202"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201999202" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201999202">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:27)</a>:</h4>
<p>I'm inclined to leave them as distinct things for now and consider merging at some point in the future, I think</p>



<a name="201999317"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201999317" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201999317">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:28)</a>:</h4>
<p>( <span class="user-mention silent" data-user-id="219696">XAMPPRocky</span> <a href="#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25/near/201999041">said</a>:</p>
<blockquote>
<p>Like something like "There are also groups of volunteers from the community who offer their time and advice to the Rust team".</p>
</blockquote>
<p>ok, so these are community groups then. )</p>



<a name="201999379"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201999379" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> BatmanAoD (Kyle Strand) <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201999379">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:28)</a>:</h4>
<p>\o</p>



<a name="201999465"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201999465" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> XAMPPRocky <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201999465">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:29)</a>:</h4>
<p><span class="user-mention silent" data-user-id="116009">nikomatsakis</span> <a href="#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25/near/201999202">said</a>:</p>
<blockquote>
<p>I'm inclined to leave them as distinct things for now and consider merging at some point in the future, I think</p>
</blockquote>
<p>I think this the right move. Right now we don't have much of a need to have this for more teams.</p>



<a name="201999506"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201999506" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201999506">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:30)</a>:</h4>
<p>ok let me take some quick notes somewhere...<a href="https://hackmd.io/KHGL4YVPRU6QaEKoorBhrQ">here is a hackmd</a></p>



<a name="201999567"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201999567" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201999567">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:30)</a>:</h4>
<p>wait which are distinct things for now?</p>



<a name="201999577"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201999577" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201999577">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:30)</a>:</h4>
<p>side note that <span class="user-mention silent" data-user-id="116266">Santiago Pastorino</span> and I have been talking about how we should really try to find some setup to assure a bit more security for hackmd and the like</p>



<a name="201999602"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201999602" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Manish Goregaokar <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201999602">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:30)</a>:</h4>
<p>This all mostly makes sense to me</p>



<a name="201999615"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201999615" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201999615">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:30)</a>:</h4>
<p>i.e., to ensure that some random prankster doesn't scrape <a href="http://zulip-archive.rust-lang.org">zulip-archive.rust-lang.org</a> and insert offensive comments in there</p>



<a name="201999677"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201999677" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201999677">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:31)</a>:</h4>
<p>...but i'm going to worry about that later :)</p>



<a name="201999734"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201999734" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201999734">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:31)</a>:</h4>
<p>(idea we kicked around: a zulip bot where you can ping it and it will scrape the hackmd URL, find the people who are involved in the current topic, and restrict edits to those people)</p>



<a name="201999749"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201999749" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201999749">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:31)</a>:</h4>
<p>no idea how easy/hard that would be to do though :)</p>



<a name="201999918"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/201999918" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> XAMPPRocky <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#201999918">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:33)</a>:</h4>
<p><span class="user-mention silent" data-user-id="116009">nikomatsakis</span> <a href="#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25/near/201999615">said</a>:</p>
<blockquote>
<p>i.e., to ensure that some random prankster doesn't scrape <a href="http://zulip-archive.rust-lang.org">zulip-archive.rust-lang.org</a> and insert offensive comments in there</p>
</blockquote>
<p>Yeah I think it would make sense at some point to try to do an audit of our infrastructure, but that's for another time.</p>



<a name="202000622"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202000622" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202000622">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:39)</a>:</h4>
<p>OK, I think that lays out roughly what I am proposing</p>



<a name="202000633"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202000633" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202000633">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:39)</a>:</h4>
<p>I don't love the name "community group" but don't have a better one.</p>



<a name="202000647"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202000647" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202000647">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:40)</a>:</h4>
<p>I guess it's fine, it just uses the term "group" again ;)</p>



<a name="202000746"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202000746" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202000746">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:40)</a>:</h4>
<p>well, if the term group is only used for community group, then it is consistent (:  Unless you say a team is a group of people, which case its grammatical and not a label so much. (;</p>



<a name="202000761"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202000761" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202000761">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:40)</a>:</h4>
<p>I mean the term group is pretty generic I guess :)</p>



<a name="202000784"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202000784" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202000784">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:41)</a>:</h4>
<p>I was just wary of having another term like "working group' that everybody uses to mean everything</p>



<a name="202000785"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202000785" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202000785">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:41)</a>:</h4>
<p>that's the danger of it, yes</p>



<a name="202000816"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202000816" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202000816">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:41)</a>:</h4>
<p>and that is why you define things (: So. Mostly this meeting is writing that HackMD, so shall the minutes point to that?</p>



<a name="202000820"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202000820" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202000820">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:41)</a>:</h4>
<p>Or I can summarize</p>



<a name="202000842"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202000842" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202000842">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:41)</a>:</h4>
<p>pointing to it seems ok</p>



<a name="202000914"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202000914" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202000914">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:42)</a>:</h4>
<p>Hi <span class="user-mention" data-user-id="219696">@XAMPPRocky</span> --</p>



<a name="202000931"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202000931" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202000931">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:42)</a>:</h4>
<p>so I think part of this community groups idea would be finding some way to list them on the web page</p>



<a name="202000946"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202000946" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202000946">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:42)</a>:</h4>
<p>some concerns would be (1) the list gets outdated quickly maybe</p>



<a name="202000980"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202000980" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202000980">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:42)</a>:</h4>
<p>(2) it's kind of unfunded mandate on "some team" to kind of look after this list and vet things etc</p>



<a name="202000997"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202000997" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202000997">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:43)</a>:</h4>
<p>I imagine there'd be some minimal criteria (probably "must have CoC"), maybe?</p>



<a name="202001023"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202001023" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202001023">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:43)</a>:</h4>
<p>Some regular check-in process?</p>



<a name="202001038"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202001038" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202001038">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:43)</a>:</h4>
<p>mmm seems unlikely to really happen</p>



<a name="202001046"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202001046" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202001046">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:43)</a>:</h4>
<p>I wonder though if we could</p>



<a name="202001059"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202001059" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202001059">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:43)</a>:</h4>
<p>e.g. if you have a discourse instance, or a github org</p>



<a name="202001078"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202001078" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202001078">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:43)</a>:</h4>
<p>if there's some simple way to get like "is there still activity?"</p>



<a name="202001088"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202001088" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202001088">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:44)</a>:</h4>
<p>programatically</p>



<a name="202001139"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202001139" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202001139">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:44)</a>:</h4>
<p>Or basically, check in once every six months and if there is radio silence, the community group is removed from the list : D</p>



<a name="202001143"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202001143" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202001143">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:44)</a>:</h4>
<p>just so we can show a badge next to it</p>



<a name="202001144"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202001144" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> XAMPPRocky <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202001144">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:44)</a>:</h4>
<p>Yeah I think I'm more concerned with 2 than 1. Anecdotally I've heard some groups in the community aren't as welcoming and inclusive as ourselves.</p>



<a name="202001149"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202001149" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202001149">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:44)</a>:</h4>
<p>kind of like the archiving</p>



<a name="202001171"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202001171" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202001171">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:44)</a>:</h4>
<p>yeah I am a bit wary of having to make judgements</p>



<a name="202001192"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202001192" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202001192">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:44)</a>:</h4>
<p>indeed I'm wary enough that I'm tempted to nix the idea</p>



<a name="202001209"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202001209" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202001209">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:44)</a>:</h4>
<p>Well, "has a CoC" and "makes contact every six months" is pretty judgement free</p>



<a name="202001240"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202001240" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202001240">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:45)</a>:</h4>
<p>right, I guess so long as it's like this, I imagine that at some point we'll get e.g. moderation complaints against a group</p>



<a name="202001303"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202001303" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202001303">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:45)</a>:</h4>
<p>otoh it does seem useful to be able to say like "we're forming a mail handling group and we'd like to list it"</p>



<a name="202001304"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202001304" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> XAMPPRocky <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202001304">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:45)</a>:</h4>
<p><span class="user-mention" data-user-id="116009">@nikomatsakis</span> This feels like something that would be appropriate to contribute to the rust wiki or some other community resource where there's less chance that it can be seen as an endorsement.</p>



<a name="202001367"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202001367" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202001367">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:46)</a>:</h4>
<p>there isn't a rust wiki, but yes</p>



<a name="202001384"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202001384" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202001384">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:46)</a>:</h4>
<p>partially for related reasons =)</p>



<a name="202001395"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202001395" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202001395">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:46)</a>:</h4>
<p>In what official space could something be listed and not sound like an endorsement?</p>



<a name="202001404"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202001404" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202001404">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:46)</a>:</h4>
<p>but I agree that having some other resource we can point at might be nice...</p>



<a name="202001407"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202001407" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> XAMPPRocky <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202001407">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:46)</a>:</h4>
<p>There is, I mean the community wiki.</p>



<a name="202001423"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202001423" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202001423">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:46)</a>:</h4>
<p>ok, I see</p>



<a name="202001482"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202001482" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> XAMPPRocky <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202001482">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:47)</a>:</h4>
<p><a href="https://runrust.miraheze.org/wiki/Main_Page">https://runrust.miraheze.org/wiki/Main_Page</a></p>



<a name="202001520"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202001520" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202001520">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:47)</a>:</h4>
<p>in that case I could remove it from the list</p>



<a name="202001535"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202001535" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202001535">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:47)</a>:</h4>
<p>since that's not really associated with rust org</p>



<a name="202001591"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202001591" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202001591">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:48)</a>:</h4>
<p>narrowing scope always seems good to me ..</p>



<a name="202001642"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202001642" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Manish Goregaokar <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202001642">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:48)</a>:</h4>
<p>So we used to list meetup groups on the website</p>



<a name="202001653"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202001653" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Manish Goregaokar <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202001653">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:48)</a>:</h4>
<p>I feel similarly about community groups</p>



<a name="202001674"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202001674" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Manish Goregaokar <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202001674">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:48)</a>:</h4>
<p>list them in a place, not much fanfare, wth a disclaimer</p>



<a name="202001705"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202001705" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202001705">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:48)</a>:</h4>
<p>this is roughly what I had in mind</p>



<a name="202001706"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202001706" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202001706">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:48)</a>:</h4>
<p>well <a href="https://community.mozilla.org/groups/">https://community.mozilla.org/groups/</a></p>



<a name="202001737"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202001737" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202001737">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:49)</a>:</h4>
<p>community groups can be created here, if folks like</p>



<a name="202001778"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202001778" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202001778">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:49)</a>:</h4>
<p>I feel like many groups will be focused on a project</p>



<a name="202001780"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202001780" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202001780">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:49)</a>:</h4>
<p>and the community team would deal with the "are they inactive or doing nasty things" problem. So if folks want to get involved</p>



<a name="202001803"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202001803" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202001803">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:49)</a>:</h4>
<p>ok</p>



<a name="202001825"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202001825" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202001825">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:49)</a>:</h4>
<p>I guess my canonical example is something like "various people working on mail-handling software"</p>



<a name="202001889"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202001889" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202001889">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:50)</a>:</h4>
<p>or for that matter perhaps the CLI group</p>



<a name="202001935"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202001935" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202001935">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:50)</a>:</h4>
<p>Mail handling software isn't something with a beginning and an end . . .</p>



<a name="202001955"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202001955" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202001955">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:50)</a>:</h4>
<p>anyway I can go either way, I think a low-key reference on the web-page is fine, but it will imply some maintenance costs</p>



<a name="202002000"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202002000" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> XAMPPRocky <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202002000">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:51)</a>:</h4>
<p>I feel like my concern with community groups is having to try to define a level of work for the group.</p>



<a name="202002007"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202002007" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202002007">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:51)</a>:</h4>
<p><span class="user-mention silent" data-user-id="249394">Val Grimm</span> <a href="#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25/near/202001935">said</a>:</p>
<blockquote>
<p>Mail handling software isn't something with a beginning and an end . . .</p>
</blockquote>
<p>lol, I meant "community groups" -- I guess the vague term "group" being used twice is already  causing confusion :)</p>



<a name="202002018"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202002018" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202002018">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:51)</a>:</h4>
<p>I think we should have no definition?</p>



<a name="202002046"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202002046" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202002046">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:51)</a>:</h4>
<p>well, or encourage folks to go to the <a href="https://community.mozilla.org/groups/">https://community.mozilla.org/groups/</a> and create groups there and the Rust Project can just say "hey, there may be some Rust groups here"</p>



<a name="202002062"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202002062" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202002062">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:51)</a>:</h4>
<p>and the groups are community groupos</p>



<a name="202002068"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202002068" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202002068">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:51)</a>:</h4>
<p>like, we're just saying that if you want to list your name with some link, right? not that we did any "vetting" per se</p>



<a name="202002070"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202002070" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202002070">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:51)</a>:</h4>
<p>Project teams</p>



<a name="202002075"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202002075" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202002075">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:51)</a>:</h4>
<p>Community Groups</p>



<a name="202002135"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202002135" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> XAMPPRocky <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202002135">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:52)</a>:</h4>
<p>Right, but at the same time it shouldn't be a place for people to post any open source organization that has a rust project right?</p>



<a name="202002172"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202002172" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202002172">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:52)</a>:</h4>
<p>I guess I think that'd be ok</p>



<a name="202002186"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202002186" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202002186">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:52)</a>:</h4>
<p>maybe so diluted as to be useless ten</p>



<a name="202002242"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202002242" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> XAMPPRocky <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202002242">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:52)</a>:</h4>
<p>Like to be specific I would be concerned about hosting blockchain group projects.</p>



<a name="202002271"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202002271" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202002271">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:53)</a>:</h4>
<p>So, the kind of community groups you're talking about would totally fit in the Community Portal . . . and then it wouldn't be the Rust Project's problem. Community has moderation folks for this.</p>



<a name="202002283"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202002283" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202002283">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:53)</a>:</h4>
<p>Community Portal as in: <a href="https://community.mozilla.org/groups/">https://community.mozilla.org/groups/</a></p>



<a name="202002317"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202002317" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202002317">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:53)</a>:</h4>
<p>And community groups wouldn't be hosted by the Rust Project</p>



<a name="202002333"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202002333" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202002333">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:53)</a>:</h4>
<p>the term "host" feels a bit misleading</p>



<a name="202002349"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202002349" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202002349">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:53)</a>:</h4>
<p>As in not on the Github</p>



<a name="202002364"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202002364" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202002364">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:53)</a>:</h4>
<p>perhaps you just mean "list"?</p>



<a name="202002423"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202002423" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202002423">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:54)</a>:</h4>
<p>listed or on the Github</p>



<a name="202002445"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202002445" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202002445">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:54)</a>:</h4>
<p>Just a pointer to the community site</p>



<a name="202002454"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202002454" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202002454">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:54)</a>:</h4>
<p>Does this sound right?</p>



<a name="202002507"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202002507" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> XAMPPRocky <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202002507">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:54)</a>:</h4>
<p>Yeah I just meant as in having a link somewhere.</p>



<a name="202002519"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202002519" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202002519">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:54)</a>:</h4>
<p>I'm not sure what "this" refers to in that sentence. you mean giving references to some places where rust communities may be listed, <span class="user-mention" data-user-id="249394">@Val Grimm</span>?</p>



<a name="202002626"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202002626" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202002626">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:55)</a>:</h4>
<p>I guess I think that linking to e.g. mozilla community site or rust wiki is fine and harmless, but kind of orthogonal</p>



<a name="202002647"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202002647" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202002647">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:55)</a>:</h4>
<p>I'm not sure hwo many Rust groups would put themselves on the mozilla page</p>



<a name="202002677"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202002677" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202002677">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:56)</a>:</h4>
<p>but I also kind of think this isn't that big a deal</p>



<a name="202002731"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202002731" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202002731">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:56)</a>:</h4>
<p>and that people can self-organize and post periodic reminders to users etc</p>



<a name="202002746"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202002746" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202002746">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:56)</a>:</h4>
<p>without us really doing anything</p>



<a name="202002760"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202002760" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> XAMPPRocky <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202002760">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:56)</a>:</h4>
<p><span class="user-mention" data-user-id="116009">@nikomatsakis</span> Honestly I would prefer that approach of being one stepped removed. Giving people links to lists.</p>



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<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202002823" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202002823">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:56)</a>:</h4>
<p>Ok, so basically, the Rust Project wouldn't list or link to any community groups, or keep community projects on its Github.</p>



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<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202002830" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202002830">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:57)</a>:</h4>
<p>Have I got this right?</p>



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<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202002855" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202002855">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:57)</a>:</h4>
<p>Or is there a link to email lists?</p>



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<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202002862" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202002862">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:57)</a>:</h4>
<p>yes I think that's right</p>



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<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202003013" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202003013">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:58)</a>:</h4>
<p>And maybe suggest to Community Groups that if they want folks to find them they can create a group on the Mozilla Community Portal, which the Rust Project will link to instead of any individual groups?</p>



<a name="202003078"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202003078" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Val Grimm <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202003078">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:58)</a>:</h4>
<p>That's their choice, but then if they want to be more visible they can be</p>



<a name="202003184"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202003184" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> XAMPPRocky <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202003184">(Jun 25 2020 at 17:59)</a>:</h4>
<p>I think that would be the right way to go.</p>



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<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202003281" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202003281">(Jun 25 2020 at 18:00)</a>:</h4>
<p>OK. Let's remove community groups and edit hackmd?</p>



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<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202003285" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202003285">(Jun 25 2020 at 18:00)</a>:</h4>
<p>I have to run now</p>



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<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202003328" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202003328">(Jun 25 2020 at 18:00)</a>:</h4>
<p>but I think the next steps are to look at existing groups and describe how they fit into this taxonomy</p>



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<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting%202020-06-25/near/202003347" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> XAMPPRocky <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/223182-wg-governance/topic/Meeting.202020-06-25.html#202003347">(Jun 25 2020 at 18:01)</a>:</h4>
<p>Oh right, thanks everyone for attending!</p>



<hr><p>Last updated: Aug 07 2021 at 22:04 UTC</p>
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